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Man vs Machine
There will be a Man vs Machine match this October!
Vladimir Kramnik will play against Deep Fritz, the world's top-rated chess program according to the press release
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Kramnik to win
Put your shirt on Kramnik !! The stipulated conditions for the match heavily favour Kramnik and the program itself seems to contain one or two flaws which Kramnik is certain to exploit. I have watched Deep Fritz playing blitz chess and I have seen it come unstuck against supposedly inferior chess computer programs.
Man will triumph over Machine !!
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Let's hope this is so! That the human wins! Unfortunately, machines have done tremendous progress in the last years. My personal forecast is that the machine will win, but of course my support is for the human race! :-)
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i bet my left arm
on kramnik. my friend bet a nickle that he would lose.
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i think kramnick will win.
computers are still not at the top level.
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Computers are programmed by man, then the computer would be equal to the man who programmed it. The best result either the man or the computer could get is a draw - or does the speed of thinking come into this? A computer can do millions of calculations per second (and look at databases of top players games), man is at a disadvantage in this respect.
I would still go with man. Man can do the unpredictable, a computer will not.
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Machine will win
If not now, soon: They can analyse millions of positions per second, they have access to vast opening libraries, they have good endgame libraries, and the most recent software includes strategical thinking as well as tactics.
Bye bye Kramnik!
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Death-by-pawns is going to preserve his arm.
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lets hope thats a chick
putting her shirt on krammnik because i think the proggram will win
P.S. just joking
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the intermediatescore is 3-1 for mr Vladimir.
He is playing very good and it seems that he is gonna win the match. But you 'll never know!!
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3-2 for Kramnik now. He made a very bad mistake in game 5 (which would give away a whole piece), but Fritz had him in an uncomfortable position before his blunder, anyway.
There are good annotations of the games at www.chessbase.com (chessbase publishes Fritz, but they're pretty neutral in their coverage) -- scroll down to "An expert view of the match"
3 more games...
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Fritz is level!
3-3 with two games to play! Kramnik seems to be crumbling, if his beginner's error in game 5 is anything to go on!
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..is going to lose their left arm!
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after a draw in game 7. One to go!
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Kramnik is a quitter
He resigned a drawn position in game 6.
This is the current opinion circulating,
and in fact,
I played his side of the position against
cm5500 and got a draw (after a few takebacks--
because I really suck).
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programs normally can attain a performance rating
higher than their overall chess ability would
seem to allow.
Kramnik clearly has a better understanding of
chess than Fritz, and Kramnik's best game is
clearly better than Fritz'. The reason a program
can win such a match is because the human can
tire, blunder, and make psychological mistakes.
So far, Kramnik has blundered a piece in game 5,
resigned a probably drawn position in game 6,
and attempted a spectacular sacrificial
attack on Fritz' king
earlier in that game without clearly seeing the
end of the attack (clearly the wrong way to play
a computer--I wonder if it would have worked on
another top GM). Plus Kramnik is struggling
with the issue of playing in an anti-computer
style. E.g., in an earlier game, Kramnik played
Kf1 just to get Fritz out of its opening book
preparation (it was not the best move). He's
also locking up pawn chains and trading queens
early (though he tends to do this against
Kasparov too). Meanwhile, Fritz is just chugging
along, not even alive much less tired and
distracted. Sometimes it will make big positional
errors and sometimes even tactical errors if
they are very long range, but as soon as the
human makes a mistake it is ready to take advantage. This is how it gets a higher rating
than it deserves.
I'd bet on Kramnik's best game against a program
At home, I play against my CM5500 on the Light
setting (the manual says that Light's rating
is 2100, but I doubt this is accurate). If I
play casual games with 30 minutes on each side
of the clock, I'm lucky to score more than
2.0/10.0, and every one of my losses is due to
some sort of blunder. But if I give Light
30 minutes and myself unlimited time, then I can
almost always beat it within 3 or 4 hours.
I think Kramnik should play a correspondence
match against Fritz. Even if they left fritz
running 24-7, I'm sure it would lose.
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Ok, let's play on game 6
I'll take Black :) Last move 34...axb6.
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Your a bad man
brunetti. certainratio the position was winning for black with correct play. However, to win requires very long term planning. Computers cant make long term strategies, so Deep Fritz probably wouldn't have found the win. Therefore, a strong human, like brunetti, will win and Deep Fritz will only draw. The debate is why Kramnik didn't consider that Deep Fritz wouldn't be able to find the win. Maybe Kramnik thought that eventually Deep Fritz would find a way to win and he wanted to save himself for the remaining matches.
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Is the position drawn?
I've heard conflicting analysis--most claim that after Rxa6 (with the idea of Ra7-d7-d6+!) the position is technically drawn, although most say 'black retains winning chances'. What's the latest analysis on the final position?
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The match is drawn 4-4 -- a serious let down for the favorite, Kramnik.
The computers move closer to total domination. I'm switching to scrabble and monopoly.
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Let's hope we all don't have to do that, Ms. Tran :P
I haven't seen it mentioned in this forum yet, wasn't there some talk that the computer team set up speakers around kramnik so that the computer's chatter option could be heard by him? It heckled him with lines from Shakespeare, even replaced character names with his own at points. This supposedly infuriated him in game 6. At one point he asked them to turn it off, but they didn't, evidentally.
is where I got this information
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hehe... I think that article was meant to be in fun. I also read that at chessbase.
I think it would have been more effective in upsetting Kramnik if they played recordings of Kasparov whining for several hours. Or perhaps "She Blinded Me With Science" by Thomas Dolby.
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If it were me...
If it were me I'd take the Blinded me with Science over Shakespeare.
That's probably dangerous to say to a literature buff :P
For maximum irritation I'd recommend... hmm, maybe Mambo #5? Maybe the worst Yoko Ono song I can find, one even she hates.
Or an AOL commercial jingle, looped.
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Read Mig's analysis at chessbase.com.
He and other's seem to think it is a draw.
They clearly proved that if there is a win,
then it is very deep (and the computer would
most likely not find it). So far, no one seems
to have demonstrated a win for black.
Brunetti, if you can refute Mig's analysis
that shows the game is drawn he would be quite
happy to get an email from you.
Also, I don't plan to play the position against
you. My level of play is too low for it to mean
anything if you win.
In any case, let's wait for Kramnik's opinion
on the game. I'm sure he will let us know
whether he believes the position is drawn or not.